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Safe Haven Disrespect for religious views is not permitted.

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  #1  
Old March 9th, 2010
LoveShy LoveShy is offline
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Default Is it really ok to circumcise for religious reasons?

I have a Jewish friend. He was circumcised at birth. It's reasonable to assume he would have been regardless of his religion, seeing as he was born in America. He's been irreligious for years. At 18, he's not anymore Jewish than I am. Is it really alright to do something so permanent for something so uncertain as faith?

Last edited by LoveShy; March 10th, 2010 at 14:03.
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  #2  
Old March 10th, 2010
xx Royal xx xx Royal xx is offline
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Default Re: Is it really ok to circumcise for religious reasons?

Personally, I believe that it would violate the child's freedom of religion. Circumcising a child for religious reasons is pretty much forcing them into the religion.
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Old March 10th, 2010
Aspie Aspie is offline
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Default Re: Is it really ok to circumcise for religious reasons?

It isn't ok to circumcise for religious reasons as it is an assault upon a person's body, if someone came up to you and stuck you with a needle for religious reasons they could still go to jail for assaulting you same applies with circumcision.
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Old March 10th, 2010
admin admin is online now
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Default Re: Is it really ok to circumcise for religious reasons?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrrestoreuk View Post
Bingo.

I very nearly sued over my circ here in the UK. The lawyer said that the case would have hinged on the Human Rights Act, which guarantees a persons freedom of religion.
Since 3% of Jews do not circumcise, a Jew could sue for being denied the right to be "that" kind of Jew.

-Ron
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  #5  
Old March 17th, 2010
greg_b greg_b is offline
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Default Re: Is it really ok to circumcise for religious reasons?

Religion is faith based. What is right or wrong is based on the teachings of that religion.

That said, our government does protect the rights of children including their right to bodily integrity, even to the extent that it prohibits parents and guardians from carrying out some religious actions, female genital modification being one example.

Unfortunately, our government has not given the same protection to male children yet.

Some might say it was right, some might say it was wrong.

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  #6  
Old March 18th, 2010
photenman photenman is offline
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Default Re: It is not ok to circumcise for religious reasons

The answer is no. There is a good discussion of the law by Doctors Opposing Circumcision in their circumcision policy statement, here: http://www.doctorsopposingcircumcisi...atement10.html. To quote:

"Protection from religion-based abuse. Some would argue that religious beliefs give a parent the right to violate a child’s right to bodily integrity, however, that is not the case. The law makes a very clear distinction between the right to believe, which is absolute, and the right to practice religion, which may be limited by laws of general application. According to the 1878 United States Supreme Court:

"Laws," we said, "are made for the government of actions, and while they cannot interfere with mere religious belief and opinions, they may with practices. . . . Can a man excuse his practices to the contrary because of his religious belief? To permit this would be to make the professed doctrines of religious belief superior to the law of the land, and in effect to permit every citizen to become a law unto himself."

Children are entitled to protection from religiously inspired abuse. This matter was settled by the United States Supreme Court in the case of Prince v. Massachusetts. The court said:

“The right to practice religion freely does not include liberty to expose the community or the child [p167] to communicable disease or the latter to ill health or death. People v. Pierson, 176 N.Y. 201, 68 N.E. 243. [n13] The catalogue need not be lengthened. It is sufficient to show … that the state has a wide range of power for limiting parental freedom and authority in things affecting the child's welfare, and that this includes, to some extent, matters of conscience and religious conviction." and famously:

Parents may be free to become martyrs themselves. But it does not follow they are free, in identical circumstances, to make martyrs of their children before they have reached the age of full and legal discretion when they can make that choice for themselves."
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  #7  
Old March 19th, 2010
SamJS SamJS is offline
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Default Re: Is it really ok to circumcise for religious reasons?

I say NO. I was born into a Jewish family in the USA (double whammy), and I asked my dad about circumcision yesterday, and he said he didn't know anything about it, and after I explained to him how harmful it is, he asked why people do it. Well, way to go, that's what I was asking him to begin with. I say faith builds complacency - faith in religion, faith in culture, faith in establishment; it's time people actually start to THINK.
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  #8  
Old March 20th, 2010
nyforhud nyforhud is offline
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Default Re: Is it really ok to circumcise for religious reasons?

No It's NOT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Now we have soap and water to wash with. For 2000 years ago they didn't so NO it's NOT ok to circumcise for religious reasons. Only reason they do it is tradition ! ! It's so stupid !!
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Old March 21st, 2010
SamJS SamJS is offline
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Default Re: Is it really ok to circumcise for religious reasons?

I've recently become good friends with a Rabbi (who is, in honesty, by far, the coolest Orthodox Jew I've ever met). We recently went bowling and played pool together, and he won every time. I went over to his home and played with his children, and we talk sports, politics (libertarian), juggling, healthy lifestyles, everything. He's really "modern," in a religious sense, even though he's orthodox, and is very understanding. I talked to him last summer about my feelings on circumcision, but now that I know him better, I'm hoping that this summer I can have a deeper discussion about it. The last discussion I had with him already has escaped my mind and I don't remember exactly where the talk went, but now that I'm much more open to talking about it and have a better handle on it, I think it's something worth discussing again. I would really like to get down to the root of understanding circumcision in Jewish culture, and I'd like to find out if it's talked about anywhere (like the Talmud) about suppressing pleasure in order to build a relationship with God. Not sure if this was pertinent to the thread; if not, someone can delete it.
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  #10  
Old March 22nd, 2010
BamaDude BamaDude is offline
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Default Re: Is it really ok to circumcise for religious reasons?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SamJS View Post
I would really like to get down to the root of understanding circumcision in Jewish culture, and I'd like to find out if it's talked about anywhere (like the Talmud) about suppressing pleasure in order to build a relationship with God.
Moses Maimonides, a medieval Rabbi, pretty much stated what you suspect the original intentions of circumcision are straight out. Here's a link to some of his quotes on the subject of circumcision:
http://www.cirp.org/library/cultural/maimonides/
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