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  #1  
Old April 26th, 2012
GSrestorer2k GSrestorer2k is offline
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Posts: 56
Default Removing Intactivism from a Part of my life

I deleted most of my 'intactivist' friends on Facebook, with the exception of guys like Ron Low. I did Youtube videos on the issue that got a decent number of views, but now I kind of regret letting this part of my life seep into other parts of my life.

A lot of the 'community' was making me uncomfortable (particularly the people adding me). It's creepy to see people who are like 90% naked in their photos in some bondage pose adding me.

I figure part of this is because of the messed up things circumcision does to people. To an extent I regret doing videos on the subject, and while I'll still bring up mutilation it's not exactly constructive to shove it in people's faces all the time. It's a fine line between wanting to keep you social life with people who potentially have deep cognitive dissonance over this issue, and wanting to help others. I feel the Youtube videos I've done is sufficient for now. I mostly want to finish restoring, and maybe I'll bem ore comfortable helping now. I've only been at the TLC for 5 weeks, so I have a long way to go. The whole issue is hard for me to deal with, but I don't think being around people who are completely defeated by it is healthy for me mentally. I've given a lot, but I have to live my life (circumcised or not, restoring or not).

So I will just be posting on here, for advice, helping others, and doing what I can, but I realize making this such a huge part of my life, I can't actually get away from it, and a lot of the mindsets of people who realize the horror of circumcision is just too corrosive for myself to handle anymore.
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  #2  
Old April 26th, 2012
Jamie Jamie is offline
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Default Re: Removing Intactivism from a Part of my life

This is the truth though isn't it? I find myself arguing with people over and it makes me feel that I am wrong, and circumcision is no deal at all. I go out for a walk and replenish my oxygen levels, and my mind comes back to the reality of it quite swiftly. We do need to live our lives, there is no doubt, but for many it's very difficult to put this behind them when they are reminded of it everyday when they attach bits of equipment to their organs. Seeing as its very likely that foreskin restoration is un-doing some of the damage caused, then we must do what we can.

I keep being tempted to talk to people about it incase I find someone that was cut and I can tell them the truth, but there's another fine line between helping someone and hurting someone by doing this. It's sad that you regret some videos that you have done, as they can only be a good thing for society. I am now thinking of doing my own, yet there do seem to be plenty around now though.
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  #3  
Old April 26th, 2012
asdfjklmeh1 asdfjklmeh1 is offline
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Default Re: Removing Intactivism from a Part of my life

I foresaw this being a possible challenge at the beginning, and made the choice to keep my intactivism in a watertight container apart from my electronic "social" life, at the moment. There are times when I do have very intactivist conversations with people, but I pick and choose these moments to control exposure, and to avoid being the one man against a crowd. There is not any place on the internet where my face or my name appears in conjunction with my intactivism, and while this seems cowardly, I call this covert.

The way I approach intactivism is sneaky--a social game of chess to be carefully played on a daily basis, picking and choosing, testing people with rhetoric without their realizing it, and sometimes slowly developing and steering conversations to talk about the true harm of what circumcision does to both men and women. I might find myself against a wall of a person. I simply carefully erode him/her on this issue, over time. I might find an open mind. An easy conquest.

An example: already I've had people come to me (as a student of medicine) and ask me what they can do about their erectile dysfunction as early as the age of 20. 20! I asked the standard questions, (anti-depressants, any change in diet, lifestyle, steroid/hormone use, etc). I asked what happened, specifically. This person said "I don't feel anything after about two minutes, and I have to fight to keep an erection." I asked the question about circumcision. You can probably guess what the answer was.

Moments like these is where my intactivism manifests.

I wait carefully, and when the topic comes up, I subliminally undermine any and every argument for infant genital cutting in a way that is innocuous and nonchalant, citing specific medical and ethical problems thereof.

I cheer on the people (the real heroes) trying to convince crowds. I genuinely do. The real heroes out there are the outspoken intactivists, fighting for what they believe in. What I do is fight behind the lines, and spread the word slowly. I know and I've seen the people I've touched do the same. Grassroots style.

I've seen the intactivist mindsets take a hold of a few close personal friends with only a few thought-provoking words on my behalf, and their own personal growth. I've seen them spread these thoughts to others. I've helped them spread these thoughts to others, in an unspoken and agreed-upon shared mission, occasionally. My effects are small, subtle, but I feel one-on-one intactivism spreading this way gives a better chance for changing an individual.

For me, at least, I feel it is more effective to change the world one person at a time, in my immediate circle, and I love seeing my own friends do the same. I am not eloquent in front of crowds, and don't know if I could do much on a large-scale in front of a crowd.

The end of slavery had its underground railroad. I am a fighter for underground intactivism, catalyzing the thought process in others for their own development later, with largely positive outcomes. I won't stop spreading the truth. I am but a spark in the middle of a prairie, watching in amazement as the world sets itself ablaze by my mere stepping foot down in a small way, and watching the rippling flames spread outward.

GSrestorer2k, you've done intactivism good, and I applaud you for everything you have done so far. I hope you continue to fight to change the world in your own way, and I tip my hat to you. Cheers!

Signed,

Another guy just doing what he can.
__________________
Men Speak out Against Circumcision (Youtube Playlist)

There is NO GOOD EXCUSE for genital abuse.
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  #4  
Old April 30th, 2012
Zeg25 Zeg25 is offline
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Posts: 58
Default Re: Removing Intactivism from a Part of my life

Quote:
Originally Posted by asdfjklmeh1 View Post
I foresaw this being a possible challenge at the beginning, and made the choice to keep my intactivism in a watertight container apart from my electronic "social" life, at the moment. There are times when I do have very intactivist conversations with people, but I pick and choose these moments to control exposure, and to avoid being the one man against a crowd. There is not any place on the internet where my face or my name appears in conjunction with my intactivism, and while this seems cowardly, I call this covert.

The way I approach intactivism is sneaky--a social game of chess to be carefully played on a daily basis, picking and choosing, testing people with rhetoric without their realizing it, and sometimes slowly developing and steering conversations to talk about the true harm of what circumcision does to both men and women. I might find myself against a wall of a person. I simply carefully erode him/her on this issue, over time. I might find an open mind. An easy conquest.

An example: already I've had people come to me (as a student of medicine) and ask me what they can do about their erectile dysfunction as early as the age of 20. 20! I asked the standard questions, (anti-depressants, any change in diet, lifestyle, steroid/hormone use, etc). I asked what happened, specifically. This person said "I don't feel anything after about two minutes, and I have to fight to keep an erection." I asked the question about circumcision. You can probably guess what the answer was.

Moments like these is where my intactivism manifests.

I wait carefully, and when the topic comes up, I subliminally undermine any and every argument for infant genital cutting in a way that is innocuous and nonchalant, citing specific medical and ethical problems thereof.

I cheer on the people (the real heroes) trying to convince crowds. I genuinely do. The real heroes out there are the outspoken intactivists, fighting for what they believe in. What I do is fight behind the lines, and spread the word slowly. I know and I've seen the people I've touched do the same. Grassroots style.

I've seen the intactivist mindsets take a hold of a few close personal friends with only a few thought-provoking words on my behalf, and their own personal growth. I've seen them spread these thoughts to others. I've helped them spread these thoughts to others, in an unspoken and agreed-upon shared mission, occasionally. My effects are small, subtle, but I feel one-on-one intactivism spreading this way gives a better chance for changing an individual.

For me, at least, I feel it is more effective to change the world one person at a time, in my immediate circle, and I love seeing my own friends do the same. I am not eloquent in front of crowds, and don't know if I could do much on a large-scale in front of a crowd.

The end of slavery had its underground railroad. I am a fighter for underground intactivism, catalyzing the thought process in others for their own development later, with largely positive outcomes. I won't stop spreading the truth. I am but a spark in the middle of a prairie, watching in amazement as the world sets itself ablaze by my mere stepping foot down in a small way, and watching the rippling flames spread outward.

GSrestorer2k, you've done intactivism good, and I applaud you for everything you have done so far. I hope you continue to fight to change the world in your own way, and I tip my hat to you. Cheers!

Signed,

Another guy just doing what he can.
I agree with that completely. It sounds like you may have done more then me, more artfully at that. I cannot afford to let my intactivism leak into my real life because that would ruin any chance I have to get a career. I still have done what I can to get my story out there and I am proud of that. I hope you are also GSrestorer. Every thing you have done has helped. I am sorry if you got too deep into this mess, but try not to completely give up. Everything we say does make a difference, I think.
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  #5  
Old April 30th, 2012
intact intact is offline
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Default Re: Removing Intactivism from a Part of my life

try this. print some pamFlets and hand them to muslim people you encounter in the streets with babies.
why muslims? because they are universally keen genital mutilators.
also, chances are, that kids to muslim families have a few years of intactness, so you are probably not too late.

this works especially well in non-mutilating countries with muslim immigrant majorities. their culture and friends are not going to push them so much towards mutilating in such countries.

This is going to work less in the USA and islamic countries. England would be a good country for this kind of thing. I think the trick is to be smart, and target people who have a good opportunity not to mutilate.

Of course you could just hand out pamphlets at random, but I feel it is too stressfull to bear.

I do not recommend hanging around and talking to these people, unless you want to hear the usual garbage. Or get jumped. Just slip them the paper and move on.

I also recommend giving them to muslim women rather than men. They are themselves usually not victims and will not get so defensive.

I have done this a couple of times and while it is scary to approach strangers, it is fun and has some good karma attached to it.
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  #6  
Old April 30th, 2012
admin admin is offline
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Posts: 8,665
Default Re: Removing Intactivism from a Part of my life

Quote:
Originally Posted by intact View Post
I also recommend giving them to muslim women rather than men.
Some will never shake a man's hand or accept anything from the hand of a non-related male.
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  #7  
Old May 1st, 2012
imahokie imahokie is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 352
Default Re: Removing Intactivism from a Part of my life

I have similar thoughts as you. Sometimes I don't know what to make of the intactivist community. I went through the grieving process. I get that for awhile every time you take a shower you are reminded, but I don't get the things that you mention. (ie the pictures) Do people not question what that looks like to outsiders? I'm part of this community and I don't even want to see that. I mean when I was restoring I would look at progress pics for motivation/see where I was. I would look at demonstrations for out to put on the device. But why do you have pictures of yourself nearly naked on facebook or as your avatar? I just don't think that is good publicity to most people.

I want to choose my next words here carefully, as for whatever reason the percentage of gays in the restoration community is much higher than the percentage of gays in the average population. Also, I see what happens at gay pride events. There is quite a lot of risque stuff, and I think some of that spills over into intactivism. That can be off putting in a big way. I first came to intactivism through a yahoo answer. A trivial yahoo answer. I thought it was worth investigating so I followed up on it and found, "Whose Body, Whose Choice?" But then I think, what if my first exposure was this site, or another site where you see people represent themselves in that way. Would I still have been interested? I don't think so.

The bottom line that I am getting at is that we need to be careful about the way that we present ourselves. Yes circumcision is a cutting of genitals, and yes restoration involves the genitals. There is certainly a place for that kind of photos for the reasons I mentioned above. But there is a very fine line between that, and being a little too flamboyant about it, especially on venues that are not about restoration. (ie facebook) I for one am very grateful that "the dark side" is shut off from visitors so it is unlikely that that will turn people away.
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  #8  
Old May 2nd, 2012
Element786 Element786 is offline
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Default Re: Removing Intactivism from a Part of my life

It takes a "strange" person to go against the flow, on any political/social issue.

I think the main things we should keep in mind are:

1. Be friendly. Smile a lot. If you attack people for their beliefs, it just makes them cling to them even more firmly. Beliefs are a lot like Chinese Finger Traps.

2. Don't be afraid to speak out in public, but only do it among your circle of friends/acquaintances and in the context of political protests. Don't loudly talk about penises in public restaurants or places where there are children.

3. Make funny faces when people talk about circumcision. Say nagging things like, "That's a little weird to me, hahah. I could never do that to my son." and smile. Put them on the defensive - THEY'RE the strange ones. Don't look like you're trying too hard. You want them to be the ones who are doing the work.

4. Don't cite memorized statistics, because it makes you look obsessive. When someone says circumcision prevents HIV, just say something really common-sense like "Eh... plenty of cut guys get HIV. Just use a condom." When someone says everybody's circumcising their sons, just say, "That's not what I read. I'll link you to this article I read about it later, if you're interested. But I'm pretty sure most newborn boys aren't cut these days."

And always finish off with, "Either way, it just doesn't seem right to me. I couldn't do it to my son."

That's not an objective claim they can dispute - it's your opinion. So when you say that, it forces them to acknowledge that there are other OPINIONS on the matter, and they should be respected. And that makes them realize that maybe their own son will feel the same way when he grows up.
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  #9  
Old May 2nd, 2012
imahokie imahokie is offline
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Posts: 352
Default Re: Removing Intactivism from a Part of my life

Quote:
Originally Posted by Element786 View Post
It takes a "strange" person to go against the flow, on any political/social issue.

I think the main things we should keep in mind are:

1. Be friendly. Smile a lot. If you attack people for their beliefs, it just makes them cling to them even more firmly. Beliefs are a lot like Chinese Finger Traps.

2. Don't be afraid to speak out in public, but only do it among your circle of friends/acquaintances and in the context of political protests. Don't loudly talk about penises in public restaurants or places where there are children.

3. Make funny faces when people talk about circumcision. Say nagging things like, "That's a little weird to me, hahah. I could never do that to my son." and smile. Put them on the defensive - THEY'RE the strange ones. Don't look like you're trying too hard. You want them to be the ones who are doing the work.

4. Don't cite memorized statistics, because it makes you look obsessive. When someone says circumcision prevents HIV, just say something really common-sense like "Eh... plenty of cut guys get HIV. Just use a condom." When someone says everybody's circumcising their sons, just say, "That's not what I read. I'll link you to this article I read about it later, if you're interested. But I'm pretty sure most newborn boys aren't cut these days."

And always finish off with, "Either way, it just doesn't seem right to me. I couldn't do it to my son."

That's not an objective claim they can dispute - it's your opinion. So when you say that, it forces them to acknowledge that there are other OPINIONS on the matter, and they should be respected. And that makes them realize that maybe their own son will feel the same way when he grows up.
^^^Great Post^^^
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  #10  
Old May 2nd, 2012
AnonL AnonL is offline
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Default Re: Removing Intactivism from a Part of my life

Quote:
Originally Posted by imahokie View Post
^^^Great Post^^^
I agree, great post. Those suggestions are totally counterintuitive to how I handle the issue but they make sense to me. Might make it easier for me to talk about MGM.
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